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  • Dump truck repair

    Need some advice on this one!
    Need to weld in the hydraulic dump tank between the bed rails on the dump truck. both the tank ends and the bed rails are 3/8" material. I plan to use a lap joint as was originally done. the first (root pass I would use the MM210 and .035 wire & gas) then I don't know. Should I use the syncrowave 180 and stick weld with 7018 or what. Oh yes, originally these were only welded along the top. No vertical welds and no welds along the bottom. Some where on this forum I read a post that said never use vertical welds on car or trailer beds. I assume the same holds true here as it would cause stress risers. Not sure why it wouldn't be welded along the bottom though' I would think it would make it stronger. This tank is also the anchor point for the three dump rams (5"D x 49"L with 2.25" rods) Its a 5 yard dump truck. When it broke under load it caused quite a bit of damage, took out the drive shaft, tank and severly bent one ram rod. I don't want a repeat.
    Any advice recommendations will be appreciated. PS I can post pictures if needed
    Harold
    Harold
    Craftsman Colormatic AC
    Victor Journyman Setup
    Syncrowave 180 SD
    MM210 With Spoolgun
    Dynasty 200 DX
    Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
    Miller HD Tape Measure

  • #2
    Harold, if this tank is also the support for the rams, then it needs to have a super reinforced top and it should be bolted to the rails. The top should be designed primarily to support the rams and secondly to hold the oil tank up. You should avoid welding on the rails whenever possible, I extend frames and shorten trucks on occasion and you can weld this support in if necessary, but it would be better to bolt it in if you are putting it between the rails. Send me a picure or write me direct if needed and I will help as much as possible. I probably won't be able to check the board again until Sat. afternoon or Monday morning.
    Last edited by Mike Sherman; 09-14-2002, 01:03 PM.
    Respectfully,
    Mike Sherman
    Shermans Welding

    Comment


    • #3
      photo

      Mike this photo shows the damage to the tank and ram support. It mounts between the rails on the bed. Also the rails are marked do not drill any holes.
      Harold
      Craftsman Colormatic AC
      Victor Journyman Setup
      Syncrowave 180 SD
      MM210 With Spoolgun
      Dynasty 200 DX
      Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
      Miller HD Tape Measure

      Comment


      • #4
        Truck Rams

        Picture of damaged rams. before being repaired
        Harold
        Craftsman Colormatic AC
        Victor Journyman Setup
        Syncrowave 180 SD
        MM210 With Spoolgun
        Dynasty 200 DX
        Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
        Miller HD Tape Measure

        Comment


        • #5
          Truck pictures

          Mike this shows the failed weld on the bed before it was cleaned up. Note the most sever damage occurred on the opposit side where it was literally torn loose.
          Harold
          Craftsman Colormatic AC
          Victor Journyman Setup
          Syncrowave 180 SD
          MM210 With Spoolgun
          Dynasty 200 DX
          Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
          Miller HD Tape Measure

          Comment


          • #6
            Truck pictures

            This photo is a closeup of the rails after the old weld was ground out. note the do not drill warning.
            Harold
            Craftsman Colormatic AC
            Victor Journyman Setup
            Syncrowave 180 SD
            MM210 With Spoolgun
            Dynasty 200 DX
            Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
            Miller HD Tape Measure

            Comment


            • #7
              truck tank

              This shows the tank and ram supports. It has been repaired and is ready to be installed between the rails. the long sides of the end caps are the only place it was welded; They go up.
              note these have been cleaned up but rusted a little waiting on me to deciede how to proceed. They will be givin a final cleaning befor installation.
              Harold
              Craftsman Colormatic AC
              Victor Journyman Setup
              Syncrowave 180 SD
              MM210 With Spoolgun
              Dynasty 200 DX
              Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
              Miller HD Tape Measure

              Comment


              • #8
                truck rails

                This picture shows the pair of rails where the tank mounts. It is ready for installing the tank. I have a lot more pictures Mike but I don't think it would add anything to post them. If there is something specific that needs to be shown please let me know.
                Didn't really think when this new board was put up that i would be posting pictures but... Its a great plus for us beginers. I like it
                Harold
                Craftsman Colormatic AC
                Victor Journyman Setup
                Syncrowave 180 SD
                MM210 With Spoolgun
                Dynasty 200 DX
                Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
                Miller HD Tape Measure

                Comment


                • #9
                  truck rails

                  This picture shows the pair of rails where the tank mounts. It is ready for installing the tank. I have a lot more pictures Mike but I don't think it would add anything to post them. If there is something specific that needs to be shown please let me know.
                  Didn't really think when this new board was put up that i would be posting pictures but... Its a great plus for us beginers. I like it
                  Harold
                  Craftsman Colormatic AC
                  Victor Journyman Setup
                  Syncrowave 180 SD
                  MM210 With Spoolgun
                  Dynasty 200 DX
                  Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
                  Miller HD Tape Measure

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Harold, I think I now have a clear picture what you are doing. I will try to address all of your concerns at once, if I miss something write me I will address it. The frame rails to the truck state "Do not drill the flange" that is the top and bottom returns on the rail, not the large flat web. I see that someone has welded the angle iron to the top of the flange, that is also not exactly correct (it should have flanges welded to the outside that drop down over the outside of the rails and then be through bolted in the web), but since it is already done we won't discuss it. It appears that the welding you need to do is not on the actual frame rails but on the angle that has been added on top of them. If this is correct than you may weld away without concern. I would use E7018 that has been properly stored or flux cored wire. Use a good three pass fillet and weld it all the way around. If I am correct in that you are not welding on the original frame rails, than you can weld all the way around it and not worry about the stress lines in the rails. Do not use short circuit mig on this, it will probably fail if you do. There should be a good enough fit up on this one to weld all three passes with E7018. If not, try to get a better fit up. If a perfect fit up is not possible, you may fill any large gaps with the mig, but only the gap and then put your three pass over that. Good luck and let me know how it turns out.
                    Respectfully,
                    Mike Sherman
                    Shermans Welding

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      DUMP TRUCK...........HMMMMMMMM .......... LOOKS MORE LIKE A ROLL BACK TO ME, BUT I'M ONLY GUESSING AND HOW MANY AXLE'S ARE ON THIS.........?......ROCK.... [email protected]

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Reply to Mike Sherman

                        Many many thanks Mike; I feel better already. The angle iron welded to the top was that way when I bought the truck this past June, I thought it was original and considered a part of the rail. Anyway the weld to that angle is the support for the tank and the weld on one side rail failed (also the tank to angle iron support was weld on the top only); it precipitated the disaster that followed. When I inspected the welds of the failed side the remnents of the weld on the angle iron were badly fractured throughout. One last question do you recommend I drill and bolt through the angle iron in addition to welding it? I plan to weld it tommorow (practice today as I did yesterday ) My welds look pretty good . I cut off sections and bent them severly with an anvil and a drilling hammer so I think they will hold. My new syncrowave 180 sure is nice and a pleasure to use.
                        Harold
                        Harold
                        Craftsman Colormatic AC
                        Victor Journyman Setup
                        Syncrowave 180 SD
                        MM210 With Spoolgun
                        Dynasty 200 DX
                        Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
                        Miller HD Tape Measure

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Harold, it won't hurt to bolt them as well as weld. A catastraphic failure like you had could have been avoided with a better design. Bolting as well as welding will help, particularly if you are not a professional welder with loads of experience. Good luck.
                          Respectfully,
                          Mike Sherman
                          Shermans Welding

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hardened 1/2" bolts coming up. Thanks Mike for all the advice and taking time to read these posts
                            Harold
                            Harold
                            Craftsman Colormatic AC
                            Victor Journyman Setup
                            Syncrowave 180 SD
                            MM210 With Spoolgun
                            Dynasty 200 DX
                            Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
                            Miller HD Tape Measure

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Truck picture

                              Rock Here is a picture of the truck. It's a 1969 International dump. (single axil). The bed is raised on cribbing to allow safe work access.
                              Harold
                              Harold
                              Craftsman Colormatic AC
                              Victor Journyman Setup
                              Syncrowave 180 SD
                              MM210 With Spoolgun
                              Dynasty 200 DX
                              Spectrum 625 Plasma Cutter
                              Miller HD Tape Measure

                              Comment

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