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  • Ac, dc-, dc+

    At the same amperage with same electrode, say 6011 in 1/8” at 90 amps, how are the arc characteristics different for AC, DCEP, DCEN. Not talking about arc blow and basic AC and DC differences. Is one setting more aggressive? One less penetrating? For flat work.
    TIA.
    Garfish

    Hobart 160i
    Lincoln 225/125 AC/DC

  • #2
    First, 6011 is designed for AC and 6010 is Designed for DCEP, both would have less penetration and harder to weld with DCEN
    Last edited by MilitiaMetals; 08-29-2020, 10:03 PM. Reason: n/a

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    • #3
      What exactly are you welding, I personally dislike 6010/6011 for flat, too easy to trap slag as they're fast freeze rods, at least in other positions you have gravity helping from slag getting trapped in undercut. Flat work, I'd use a 7024 or 7018 personally. Maybe 6013 if it's super thin.

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      • #4
        I didn't ask the question well (stick welding newbie here). What I am trying to get to is if everything else is held constant, for an electrode that can be used by all 3 currents (AC, DC + & -), how generally is the arc different? For an electrode with the 4th digit saying all three currents. I don't have access to an AC machine (or have much experience ;-) ) or I'd just give it a try to see. I am trying to understand stick better, but the question may not make a lot of real world sense. The application could be mild steel coupons. Thanks.
        Garfish

        Hobart 160i
        Lincoln 225/125 AC/DC

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        • #5
          Originally posted by garfish View Post
          I didn't ask the question well (stick welding newbie here). What I am trying to get to is if everything else is held constant, for an electrode that can be used by all 3 currents (AC, DC + & -), how generally is the arc different? For an electrode with the 4th digit saying all three currents. I don't have access to an AC machine (or have much experience ;-) ) or I'd just give it a try to see. I am trying to understand stick better, but the question may not make a lot of real world sense. The application could be mild steel coupons. Thanks.
          In general, the dc welding arc is more stable with most electrodes and the ability to change polarity allows greater control over arc performance and penetration. The ac arc is not as stable or controllable, but is the best alternative when welding magnetized steel, and allows the use of a cheaper and less complex welder.

          Here is an article that will clarify:

          https://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-u...ty-detail.aspx
          Last edited by Northweldor; 08-30-2020, 01:30 PM.

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          • #6
            Northwwelder, good concise article. It is my understanding that AC is good when using large electrodes at relatively high currents. Perhaps because the penetration is adequate, the melt-off rate is good and arc blow is minimized.
            --- RJL ----------------------------------------------

            Ordinarily I'm insane, but I have lucid moments when I'm merely stupid.
            -------------------------

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            • #7
              In my opinion the only time to use AC is if 1) you don't have a machine capable of DC or 2) you're getting large amounts of uncorrectable arc blow, such as on highly magnetized materials like drill pipe and sucker rod. Most electrodes are designed for electrode positive, those that are designed for both DCEP and DCEN will give more penetration on DCEP. The times I would use DCEN would be with a 6013 on thin sheet metal to control penetration a little better, or with 7024 on thin material again to help control the depth of penetration.

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              • #8
                Before i had a MIG welder I used 6013 DCEN to repair a mower deck. Learned to weld with AC, first a Lincoln tombstone then a Craftsman. Once I got the Hobart Stickmate AC/DC I never used AC.
                Blacksmith
                Stickmate LX AC/DC
                Big cheap (Chinese) Anvil
                Hand cranked coal forge
                Freon bottle propane forge
                HH 210 and bottle of C25

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                • #9
                  Here's some info that might be of use. https://www.thefabricator.com/thefab...-6011-and-7018

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                  • #10
                    I havnt ran an AC in so long I cant recall about the current, its not too far from the same. 11 was formulated so it will run on AC but its better on DC. I like it a little better than 10, think it restarts a little easier.
                    http://www.facebook.com/cary.urka.urkafarms

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                    • #11
                      While 13 is babbled about for thin sheet I don't care for it as the current is way higher than 6011. The 11 digs but that's an operator thing, I took test at a power plant, sheet duct work, 11 dcrp.
                      I have used 13, used it a lot on old AC machines and the only reason I would use it today is if I only had AC or it was the only rod I had. I don't stock it. About the only place it's used is the part timers. Sign companies, farms etc. It's not a bad thing, just don't use it.
                      Last edited by Sberry; 01-03-2021, 09:17 PM.
                      http://www.facebook.com/cary.urka.urkafarms

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                      • #12
                        There is a lot of talk about magnetized metal but I never really had a problem.
                        http://www.facebook.com/cary.urka.urkafarms

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                        • #13
                          I don't know about magnetized but I had pretty severe arc blow when welding inside corner joints on heavy tubing a few times. One fix is to switch to AC, but the other fix is even better. Parallel your work clamp and clamp to both sides of the joint.

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