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190 or ? For 1/4",10g, 3/8"

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  • #16
    My recommendation for a welding helmet would be a Lincoln Viking 3350 or 2450 with the 4C technology lens. For MIG, out of all the different lens I've tried over the years my Viking 3350 4C is my favorite. The level of puddle definition and the level of view that you have beyond the weld zone with the 4C in quite amazing.

    Having ran all of Hobarts current units from the Handler 130 up to the Ironman 230, I feel that the 190 may be borderline for what you are wanting to do. The Handler 210 would more than likely be a better choice. With the Ironman 230 being even a better choice yet.. Doubting you want to spend Ironman 230 level money though, so my recommendation in the Hobart line up would be the Handler 210 MVP.

    I owned a PowerMIG 180C for quite a few years. It's a very nice performing unit, however, its under powered for what you are wanting to do.

    MigMaster 250- Smooth arc with a good touch of softness to it. Good weld puddle wetout. Light spatter producer.
    Ironman 230 - Soft arc with a touch of agressiveness to it. Very good weld puddle wet out. Light spatter producer.


    PM 180C



    HH 125 EZ - impressive little fluxcore only unit

    Comment


    • #17
      I've been using an HTP Stiker Supreme from USA Welds for a little over a year now. I'm very satisfied with it. Darkens in 1/30,000 th of a second with a rating of 1/1/1/1 for optical clarity just like the pricey ones. I agree with Dan on the 210, I debated over the 190 and opted to spend a little more for the 210 and feel that it is the best deal out there for the non pro hobbyist. What ever you buy good luck and have fun.

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      • #18
        Welded various thicknesses of steel using gas and it's my first welder ever.
        I'm a rookie and with this machine it made building a new syrup evaoevapor wood burner out of a old 275 gallon oil tank pretty easy...
        All the present settings were dead on and worked as it should with a wide range of thicknesses
        My biggest hurdle was getting it feeding the wire the correct speed( wire fell off switch on backside and unit was putting out wire at one speed no matter where you turned speed to)
        I need more practice to make welds pretty looking , but welds are strong and process was easy to pick up, once I did a few test welds on scrap to begin with...
        Metal prep is critical to get a good weld( going slag off new metal, and grind paint/ primer off old stuff good first then get good ground as close to where your welding as possible.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Dan View Post
          My recommendation for a welding helmet would be a Lincoln Viking 3350 or 2450 with the 4C technology lens. For MIG, out of all the different lens I've tried over the years my Viking 3350 4C is my favorite. The level of puddle definition and the level of view that you have beyond the weld zone with the 4C in quite amazing.

          Having ran all of Hobarts current units from the Handler 130 up to the Ironman 230, I feel that the 190 may be borderline for what you are wanting to do. The Handler 210 would more than likely be a better choice. With the Ironman 230 being even a better choice yet.. Doubting you want to spend Ironman 230 level money though, so my recommendation in the Hobart line up would be the Handler 210 MVP.

          I owned a PowerMIG 180C for quite a few years. It's a very nice performing unit, however, its under powered for what you are wanting to do.
          Since the OP rejected the Miller 211 as too pricey, and indicated he would not be doing much above 1/4", I did not say so, but I agree that you will find the 190 a bit limiting.

          However, if this is a problem, I would switch to different processes. I have an ESAB 161TS that is much more portable, dual voltage, excellent with tig for body-work (slow, but less time than GMAW when you add in grinding) and with multi-pass stick, you can weld any thickness you want. All for under $700 w/ free shipping (CyberWeld).

          This. of course, will require more skill, but, you'll be a better weldor in the end!

          Comment


          • #20
            Now I've seen the 210, but I thought this only allowed you to plug in 110/220, Is this also a more powerful unit than the 190.

            I'm not rushing into buying this tool, I just don't want to buy something that is too good for what I need, I don't want to waste extra money if that makes sense.

            Miller had a good rebate that ended in September, but I wasn't ready to drop the coin. I do think it's important to stress that these welds need to penetrate and be of good structural quality as the mods are for offroad use. If this really requires bigger than the 190, then that's what I need.


            gotta research all these hood recommendations still.

            thank you all for all of your advice thus far. There is a lot of great experienced welders I'm learning important points from, before i pull a trigger on a machine. I'm very glad I haven't rushed this purchase.

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            • #21
              The HH 190 maxes out at approximately 190A ( 200A V/A curve).

              The 210MPV maxes out at approximately 210A on 230V (220A V/A curve).
              The 210MPV maxes out at approximately 140A on 115V (170A V/A curve) making it essentially an HH 140.

              These numbers come from the owners manuals...Looking at voltage/amperage curves in manual show a little better output amperage than basic specification page...

              Dale





              Last edited by Dale M.; 10-05-2018, 09:19 AM.
              Lives his life vicariously through his own self.

              Comment


              • #22
                Just for the sake of asking, welding 16G-1/4" would you still prefer a Miller 211, mvp210 or such within this class of machine?


                as I see the prices on bigger machines, why would Hobart choose dialed voltage on something like an iron man where as miller211,215,212... All have Infinite voltage control? Is it really that big of a cost savings?

                let's get picky. 211 vs map 210. If I was to step up to the mp210, the Miller is like 1000$ with a rebate. What if anything will I gain out of that extra coin for this class of machine?

                Last edited by HOBARTxj; 10-06-2018, 09:28 AM.

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                • #23
                  A stepped voltage/amperage is done with sector switch, infinite dial selection is done with electronics.... Stepped switch is less expensive to manufacture then a dial in (electronic) control.... But that is why is Hobart machines is the economic line to the more expensive (feature rich) miller design... Both Miller and Hobart are owned by same parent company....

                  Dale
                  Lives his life vicariously through his own self.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Dale M. View Post
                    ....... Stepped switch is less expensive to manufacture then a dial in (electronic) control.... ...
                    I actually wonder about that. The stepped switch has taps going all the way into the transformer. I don't know how the electronic ones work, but wouldn't be surprised if economies of scale make it cheap. Any data one way or the other on the actual cost differences? Retail prices reflect more about consumer interest and marketability than they indicate actual build cost.

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                    • #25
                      OP, I was kind of in the same boat as you and went with the HH 210 MVP and straight co2 gas......couldn't be happier.

                      There were a few key things that weighed in on my decision to go with the 210 MVP.
                      • the price
                      • the 210 MVP being transformer based, and hopefully more reliable over time....even though on the heavy side, I don't plan on transporting it much
                      • the ability to use either 115v or 230v
                      I was a little hesitant about the 210 having a tapped voltage setting vs having auto set or digital displays, but I heard enough people say the tap settings weren't a problem to use so that made me feel a little more at ease with it.

                      The chart in the door is fairly close, but with some practice it's not too hard to adjust the wire speed to get it dialed in to hear the "bacon sizzle". I've spent a lot of time on line watching videos. Jody's Weldingtipsandtricks.com is very good.

                      I bought the Eastwood L6700 hood and have been pleased with it so far.....very clear and easy to see the puddle. Not sure how it compares to the highly recommended Viking 3350 though since I never used one. The L6700 fit my budget though, since I was buying everything else....welder, consumables, welding table, tools etc.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by MAC702 View Post

                        I actually wonder about that. The stepped switch has taps going all the way into the transformer. I don't know how the electronic ones work, but wouldn't be surprised if economies of scale make it cheap. Any data one way or the other on the actual cost differences? Retail prices reflect more about consumer interest and marketability than they indicate actual build cost.
                        Maybe Kieth will shed some light on it for us...

                        Dale
                        Lives his life vicariously through his own self.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Dale M. View Post

                          Maybe Kieth will shed some light on it for us...

                          Dale
                          No hard data, but I would still bet on the $300 figure I gave earlier, for CV over Stepped V.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by HOBARTxj View Post
                            Just for the sake of asking, welding 16G-1/4" would you still prefer a Miller 211, mvp210 or such within this class of machine?


                            as I see the prices on bigger machines, why would Hobart choose dialed voltage on something like an iron man where as miller211,215,212... All have Infinite voltage control? Is it really that big of a cost savings?

                            let's get picky. 211 vs map 210. If I was to step up to the mp210, the Miller is like 1000$ with a rebate. What if anything will I gain out of that extra coin for this class of machine?
                            For 1/4", the 200 amp machine is going to be the better choice over the 180/190 amp unit. This doesn't mean that the Handler 190 is capable of handling 1/4 though. The 200 amp machine just gives you the advantage of having a little more power and duty cycle available, if needed.

                            The 7 tap selections on the 190 or 210 give you a good level of adjustability from a machine that produces very good arc characteristic and weld puddle wet out.

                            If you have the skill set to operate it, the variable voltage dial on a Millermatic 211 is definitely going to give you a superior level of adjustability over the Handler units. Haven't ran a MM 211. I own a Multimatic 215. Arc characteristic from it are really good. What I seen on YouTube vidoes the 211 arc characteristic seem like they may be similar or identical to the 215.

                            A few advantages of the 211 over the Handler 190 or 210 would be finer adjustability of the output, more top end power ( yes even over the 210), and a wire drive designed to run a longer gun lead length.

                            Having quite a bit of experience with the unit, I will point out, if you choose to go with the Handler 190, I would be very surprised to discover that you were disappointed with the unit. Truthfully the 190 is a solid performing proven unit.
                            MigMaster 250- Smooth arc with a good touch of softness to it. Good weld puddle wetout. Light spatter producer.
                            Ironman 230 - Soft arc with a touch of agressiveness to it. Very good weld puddle wet out. Light spatter producer.


                            PM 180C



                            HH 125 EZ - impressive little fluxcore only unit

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Lincoln biking 3550 may be the hood I get, found some good prices as low as 230$. Solid reviews and demos loom very nice. One feature like of the lens is the color I've seen example of.

                              do you all prefer any type/ color out of your lenses?

                              mainly blue vs green I should ask I believe.

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                              • #30
                                For me, the bluish tint of the 3350 4c lens gives me the clearest most defined view of the MIG weld puddle , arc , and surrounding area. The greenish tint lenses provide a poor view of the MIG arc for me. The amber tints seem to be OK . The gray/neutral tint of the Miller Clear Light is pretty good, however, I still tent to prefer the bluish tint of the 4c.
                                MigMaster 250- Smooth arc with a good touch of softness to it. Good weld puddle wetout. Light spatter producer.
                                Ironman 230 - Soft arc with a touch of agressiveness to it. Very good weld puddle wet out. Light spatter producer.


                                PM 180C



                                HH 125 EZ - impressive little fluxcore only unit

                                Comment

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