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120V 140 amp MIG question

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  • 120V 140 amp MIG question

    If you had to choose one of the following in a 120V 140 amp which one would you go with? Since I have no need for welding 22 ga or thinner my choice would be unit #1.

    UNIT #1: Set up with an .030 ER70S-6 and C25 unit one produces a smooth top end arc (good mixture of crisp and soft) with very good weld puddle wet out and very light spatter. The unit is a very good 1/8" unit. Lets say it performs on 1/8" as well as a 230V unit does. Set up with with an .023 wire & C25 the unit is a good 22 ga sheet metal unit. The unit produces a similar arc quality on 22 ga as it does on 1/8".

    UNIT #2: Set up with an .030 ER70S-6 and C25 unit two produces a crisper top end arc that generates a noticable level of spatter onto the base metal. Weld puddle wet out is slightly on the sluggish side. The unit is an OK 1/8" unit at best. Set up an .023 wire and C-25 the unit produces a very soft low end arc that easily handles 22 ga. We'll rate the unit as very good to excellent for light ga sheet metal.
    MigMaster 250- Smooth arc with a good touch of softness to it. Good weld puddle wetout. Light spatter producer.
    Ironman 230 - Soft arc with a touch of agressiveness to it. Very good weld puddle wet out. Light spatter producer.


    PM 180C



    HH 125 EZ - impressive little fluxcore only unit

  • #2
    If I was buying a 120 volt 140 amp unit it would be for portability. I'd want to know the performance with straight CO2 so that I could use the Hobart Paintball kit for maximum portability.

    I don't have a lot of experience, but your performance descriptions seem to contradict themselves:

    Unit #1 has low spatter and a soft arc but is "a very good 1/8 inch unit while unit 2 has a crisper top arc and more spatter but is only an okay 1/8 unit.
    Blacksmith
    Stickmate LX AC/DC
    Big cheap (Chinese) Anvil
    Hand cranked coal forge
    Freon bottle propane forge
    HH 210 and bottle of C25

    Comment


    • #3
      I will take #3 because I like to be different. So # 1 sounds like a 140 c and a #2 sounds like a HH-140.
      Esab 2200 AC/DC
      Thermal 211i
      Thermal Pee-wee 85s
      Smith O/A plus mini torch
      Smith machine torch
      LN-25 pro
      LF-72 feeder
      Edwards 65 ton
      5X10 CNC table
      Victor A-120
      Miller Shopmate 300DX
      S-74D feeder




      Remember good judgment comes from experience, experience comes from bad judgment.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Brand X View Post
        I will take #3 because I like to be different. So # 1 sounds like a 140 c and a #2 sounds like a HH-140.
        Here's what you get then (see attachment) for going with unit #3.

        Yeah unit #2 would be a Handler 140.

        Unit # 1 isn't a 140C. Unit #1 is what I suspect would happen to the Handler 140 if we could get Hobart to go with the choke design that they're using in the Handler 187, 190, 210, and 210 MVP.

        I've never ran a 140C. As you know though I own a 180C, and compared the Handler 187 or 210 on 1/8" the 180C weld puddle doesn't wetout quite a well as the Handler unit. So, I suspect the a Handler 140 with a Handler

        On the 180C if I take the time to really play with the voltage and wire speed I can eventually find the right combination that produces a very soft low end arc like the Handler 140 does. I doubt most hobbyist though are going to spend the time it took me ( about 1/2 an hour) to find the soft low end arc. They also may not have enough understanding of operating the controls properly to find it too.
        Attached Files
        MigMaster 250- Smooth arc with a good touch of softness to it. Good weld puddle wetout. Light spatter producer.
        Ironman 230 - Soft arc with a touch of agressiveness to it. Very good weld puddle wet out. Light spatter producer.


        PM 180C



        HH 125 EZ - impressive little fluxcore only unit

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Dan View Post
          Here's what you get then (see attachment) for going with unit #3.

          This is more like it. The 131 really wet out the puddle really well, and this should be a better overall machine.
          Attached Files
          Esab 2200 AC/DC
          Thermal 211i
          Thermal Pee-wee 85s
          Smith O/A plus mini torch
          Smith machine torch
          LN-25 pro
          LF-72 feeder
          Edwards 65 ton
          5X10 CNC table
          Victor A-120
          Miller Shopmate 300DX
          S-74D feeder




          Remember good judgment comes from experience, experience comes from bad judgment.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Blacksmith View Post
            If I was buying a 120 volt 140 amp unit it would be for portability. I'd want to know the performance with straight CO2 so that I could use the Hobart Paintball kit for maximum portability.

            I don't have a lot of experience, but your performance descriptions seem to contradict themselves:

            Unit #1 has low spatter and a soft arc but is "a very good 1/8 inch unit while unit 2 has a crisper top arc and more spatter but is only an okay 1/8 unit.
            Generally transformer based units have a wider window of operation with C25 then CO², making the unit much easier to dial in a quality arc with the C25. A 60 or 80 CF cylinder of C25 easily fits in the trunk of my Wife's Dodge Neon, and a compact 140 amp unit has no problem fitting in the back seat.

            I actually stated that unit #1 produces a smooth top end arc that is a good mixture of crisp and soft. Meaning the arc falls some where in the middle of a crisp and soft arc.

            A soft arc translates into more arc on time between short circuit transfer. This generally results in a light spatter level and a more fluid weld puddle.

            A crisper arc is the result of a more rapid rate of the short circuiting process. The crisper style arc generally has a certain amount of range were it is able to produce a light spatter level. The design of the choke is major player in establishing this range. For example with solid wire the Handler 140 top end tends to produce a fairly dense spatter field on the base metal; whereas, in roughly the same output power range, a Millermatic 180 is a able to produce a fairly light spatter field. Both units produce a crisper style arc in the output range being discussed. The lower arc on time between short circuits of the crisper style arc results in a less fluid weld puddle. The results being a weld puddle that tends to wet out slower.
            Last edited by Dan; 01-06-2012, 12:02 PM.
            MigMaster 250- Smooth arc with a good touch of softness to it. Good weld puddle wetout. Light spatter producer.
            Ironman 230 - Soft arc with a touch of agressiveness to it. Very good weld puddle wet out. Light spatter producer.


            PM 180C



            HH 125 EZ - impressive little fluxcore only unit

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Dan View Post
              A 60 or 80 CF cylinder of C25 easily fits in the trunk of my Wife's Dodge Neon, and a compact 140 amp unit has no problem fitting in the back seat.
              Likewise my HH210 and 80 cu ft bottle of C25 fits in the trunk of my Ford Focus and doesn't prevent me from driving to the ER for the hernia from lifting the 210!

              I understand the question now and support your desires to get the updated choke on the 140; it's now the oldest compact wire welder in the lineup.
              Blacksmith
              Stickmate LX AC/DC
              Big cheap (Chinese) Anvil
              Hand cranked coal forge
              Freon bottle propane forge
              HH 210 and bottle of C25

              Comment

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